i so agree...

Decide how the world should be governed and by whom.
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i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 08 Nov 2011, 11:17

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Re: i so agree...

Postby Tomsk » 08 Nov 2011, 15:25

VERY PROFOUND...
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Re: i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 08 Nov 2011, 15:36


well yes, i also agree with him....
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Re: i so agree...

Postby Wonderbunny » 08 Nov 2011, 17:14

Too true.
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Re: i so agree...

Postby Ice.Maiden » 08 Nov 2011, 17:15

Ditto.
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Re: i so agree...

Postby kg » 11 Nov 2011, 00:48


It's starting to look like civil obedience is about to change. There has certainly been massive civil disobedience breaking out all over the world. Occupy Wall Street may at some point become Occupy The World.

Okay, it isn't very likely to go to that extent, but it sometimes seems it might be heading that way.
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Re: i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 11 Nov 2011, 04:46


and i'm still not too clear why they're doing that... and ok, this will sound really childish, but i think it's very rude.... :shifty:
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Postby bermbits » 11 Nov 2011, 05:13

One view of why the occupy movement is happening: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/10/2 ... via=blog_1
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Re: i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 11 Nov 2011, 12:53


oh well, that certainly explained it! :dance:

covers stuff like when we got our hydro bills with a charge for debt retirement. um... excuse me? well, that was hydro execs running the outfit into millions of $'s red, included the boss'es million dollar [or more] package that he so truly deserved. for being fired.

ok, so we have people in the parks. how is that going to change anything? after all, we've always known about these deals and shenanigans going on... it's been accepted just like fox news spewing malice and discontent.
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Re:

Postby kg » 11 Nov 2011, 18:18

bermbits wrote:One view of why the occupy movement is happening: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/10/2 ... via=blog_1


Yes it certainly explains it. The following 2 1/2 minute video describes the root of it all, though; the root of everything that was so eloquently described in the above 'blog:

Why a Dollar & Euro Collapse Is Guaranteed

While it doesn't specifically address the reasons for the OWS movement, I believe it addresses the underlying root cause. Is it yet another "Conspiracy Theory?" I don't know.

When I viewed this video, my memory was drawn back to another thread here that pointed out that the world's debt is greater than all the money that exists, let alone exceeds the GDP of the entire world. It also called into question to whom this debt was owed (my favorite was "Space Aliens").

In fact, I think this video explains that tremendous world debt, and explains in a nutshell the situation that has generated the many and varied current situations that have brought about the OWS movement.

pilvikki wrote:ok, so we have people in the parks. how is that going to change anything? after all, we've always known about these deals and shenanigans going on... it's been accepted just like fox news spewing malice and discontent.


Yes, we've always known about them, but they have been becoming increasingly egregious over the years, culminating in the massive wake-up call in 2008 and leading up to today. The tech stock crash should have been that wake-up call, but recovery was so quick that it was quickly forgotten about (except by those who lost massive amounts of their retirement savings).

The current situation isn't so easily overlooked. We're still in the middle of it, and which way the economy will "correct" is still very uncertain. I'm still thinking this "upswing" is a bubble and that we haven't seen the bottom yet. This upswing in the economy is artificially created, with no real wealth or productivity backing it up.

It's obviously not due to an increase in manufacturing, production, or employment. Those are generally on the decrease. When there is a (usually small) increase in them, those in power tout it as indicative of how well they are doing their job. When there is a (usually large) decrease, those not in power are all over it, saying that's why they should be in power.

Truth is, it's all bovine excrement. The reports on this country's economy are based not on its production, but on the performance of Wall Street and the NYSE. I don't know about anyone else, but given the evidence, that's the only conclusion to which I can come. The existence of OWS gives evidence that I'm not the only one who has come to that conclusion.

What good will it do? Probably not too much (unless it becomes much larger and more widespread), but it might (and is) bring more focus on the problem. At the very least, those in power know that a great amount of the publics attention is focused on this very situation and they have to step lightly in the area for the foreseeable future.

How very inconvenient for them! [ img ]
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Re: i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 11 Nov 2011, 20:53


in this aspect i'm a bit of a pessimist... the only thing that will unravel the nice, tight ball of deceit and well... business as usual, would be a revolution. that then would just shift the power to a new set of opportunists and we start the cycle all over again.

just like it always has worked.

:vrysad:
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Re: i so agree...

Postby kg » 11 Nov 2011, 21:37


Yes. As Libertarian Presidential candidate Harry Browne once repeatedly stated in one of his books (I think it was "Why Government Doesn't Work"), "Utopia is not an option." It doesn't matter the quality of the structure of the government, or the integrity of those who administer it; it will eventually deteriorate. At some time in the future it will evolve into something so egregious and deleterious that another "Revolution" will be required to bring it all back in line.

One only need look back into history to find copious examples of countries and societies that rose to great heights only to deteriorate into Revolution, then oblivion. It has happened before and it will happen again.

A philosophical question has often been posed: "Would you rather live during the rise or the decline of a civilization?" For myself, I would think somewhere in the middle...the first half during the rise, middle age at the peak, then the rest during the the decline. Fitting, I think.
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Re: i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 11 Nov 2011, 21:52


i'm thinking that's what we're doing...

but then again, it depends on how one sees ascending and descending?

in some aspects we're miles ahead of our parents generation, in others we seem to be sliding backwards.
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Re: i so agree...

Postby Ice.Maiden » 12 Nov 2011, 08:44

I don't see what's so wrong in going backwards. Going forwards seems to be creating more problems than a little.
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Re: i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 12 Nov 2011, 10:54


i'm talking hard earned rights that are now being taken away: workers' rights, women's rights, animal rights...

i think it's mississippi where you can be charged for feticide, if you miscarry. like, how is that even reasonable? can't remember which [3] states allow corporal punishment on moral and religious grounds. yeah, that'll put the fear into you!

RCMP! will ignore sexual harassment as a matter of course...

etc etc.
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Re: i so agree...

Postby Ice.Maiden » 12 Nov 2011, 15:12

Yes I know, sorry. I was following one of my many branches of thought when I typed that.

The feticide charges are past a joke aren't they!
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Re: i so agree...

Postby kg » 12 Nov 2011, 16:32


pilvikki wrote:i think it's mississippi where you can be charged for feticide, if you miscarry.


Not actually. The attempt was made to put such legislation into effect in Mississippi recently, but that legislation was soundly defeated, much to the surprise of many (and the consternation of no few supporters). The defeat of that bill almost qualifies as a miracle, considering it was in Mississippi.

If passed, the bill would have set the beginning of "life" almost at erection. The woman (of course!) could almost be punished for using spermicide! I don't know what they'd charge a man with for masturbation! All the pundits on every side of the fence have been discussing it the past few days...the left with amazement and congratulations and the right with....well, you know! :P
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Re: i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 12 Nov 2011, 16:54


well. i read about a woman jailed for miscarrying in... sod my memory!

oh never mind, wrong article; in this one a woman tried to kill herself, after breaking up with her... INsignificant other? but survived, yet her baby did not... so she's in jail charged with murder. wow, what a horrible story that was. :vrysad:


3cheers for mississippi and yes, that was a relief and a surprise. digging further, they're trying to push it through in utah, georgia and hmm kentucky?

you know glenn... do you really need the country broken into all them wee bits and pieces? trying to remember them is seriously messing with my mind!
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Re: i so agree...

Postby kg » 12 Nov 2011, 17:28


No, *I* don't, but someone somewhere at some time decided it was best, so what do I know?

Let's see...Newfoundland, Quebec, Ontario, Manitoba...heck, I can never keep track of them all... :whistle:
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Re: i so agree...

Postby pilvikki » 12 Nov 2011, 17:29


exactly my point and we only have a ¼ of yours. :lol:
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